Race 6 Circuit de Catalunya 50 Laps June 5th

SSRT Pronebird wrote:

The fact that you honestly believe the driver controls 100% of the consistancy is hilarious. Some cars will react violently to even the smallest mistakes versus other cars. Some cars are so on edge that if you miss your line by a hair your lap is ruined while others can shrug it off. Not to mention that tire temps and pressures will change how a car reacts which affects how the driver has to drive the car. Humans aren't robots.

and that is what make racing, r-a-c-i-n-g


I understand both sides of this argument, but it's a one sided argument in my eyes.

So here is my 2 cents, stop whining and start practicing, there's nothing to it.

SSRT Pronebird wrote:

Bimmer is not the fastest driver and tuner in this league. He is on level with myself, spurtle, metal. That porsche is stupid easy to run fast laps every lap. No other car compares in that simple category.

My spyker may be able to run a few lap times similar to that porsche, but I can't run that lap every single lap. It is not possible with this car. The porsche is the only one like it.

You picked it.

Admin wrote:

Seriously people some of these arguments are beyond funny and seem without real thought.

KIR Matthnt wrote:

BTW everyone a 750pi McLaren F1 can easily do sub 1:41s in Spain so lets not jump all over the guy that wins each race.

I'm not complaining about anything. I think most of this is too funny for words. You guys have fun, I'll win my arguments on the race track.

Admin wrote:

That has to be the silliest thing I have heard out of this conversation to say I (the driver who said it) can't run consistent laps and blame it on the car! What does the car brake by itself? Ohhh wait it turns when it's not told to? Ohh maybe the car decides it's going to brake late and hit the sand trap on it's own! Consistency is 100% driver. Period! Any other argument is futile. As for me having a race that I did well in and got SECOND and you wanting a PI decrease for that. Are you serious? Really! I am growing weary of the simplicity of how to balance and people using the result of 1 race to ask for this or complain about that. There are a couple of tracks I love. In the Ferrari and I like myself. So by your logic I need a hit for those tracks. So when Alonzo hits a track he is always fast on, or Patrick long hits a track like long beach that he loves and usually wins or gets a top 3 he should be forced to drive car with additional penally because he is fast and consistent on that track!? Seriously people some of these arguments are beyond funny and seem without real thought.

Now your being hostile. An organizer of a sanctioned event takes into account all the variables that serve or is counter to its mission. Yours was promoting close compitition by way of R.E.W.A.R.D.S, ok so I the participant have a greivence, the decision to make me more competitive has had the opposite effect. Instead of a simple response, I am called nieve or just not trying hard enough.? unless your some kind of benevolent dictator I felt like I could bring up my issue and get a reasonable answer. Guess not. Its either I suck or so and so is better and every car is about equal, you just need to do better. Ok thats the remedy. How you guys misinterpret pace for talent is a little unsettling, specially comming from the organizer, there seems to be a toxic relationship between dis-satisfied competitors and self annointed race royalty.

I get the feeling if I have my issue addressed it will be done to shut me up because I am a whinner, really. I don't race for money I race because my 20" Assanti wheels on my G35 wont let me, and my Stang will kill me. So in the future when I whine or when some else does try to be less insulting. BTW I got pics!

[/quote]Now your being hostile. An organizer of a sanctioned event takes into account all the variables that serve or is counter to its mission. Yours was promoting close compitition by way of R.E.W.A.R.D.S, ok so I the participant have a greivence, the decision to make me more competitive has had the opposite effect. Instead of a simple response, I am called nieve or just not trying hard enough.? unless your some kind of benevolent dictator I felt like I could bring up my issue and get a reasonable answer. Guess not. Its either I suck or so and so is better and every car is about equal, you just need to do better. Ok thats the remedy. How you guys misinterpret pace for talent is a little unsettling, specially comming from the organizer, there seems to be a toxic relationship between dis-satisfied competitors and self annointed race royalty.

I get the feeling if I have my issue addressed it will be done to shut me up because I am a whinner, really. I don't race for money I race because my 20" Assanti wheels on my G35 wont let me, and my Stang will kill me. So in the future when I whine or when some else does try to be less insulting. BTW I got pics![/quote]

You make my point. Thanks. I take EVERYTHING into account. You still are only looking at it from your own perspective and your own results. I don't care who wins each race long as those capable of wining can. I have never made a super slow car or driver a front runner nor have I handicapped any one driver or car so much that they have no chance to win. And I am far from hostile, hostility takes anger. I haven't seen too many people that are hostile laughing out loud.

I have tried reasonable over and over yet the complaining by a few is constant and consistent ( hey there is that word again lol). SCIENCE since you want to point out yourself and your so called inability to compete because of your car being slow.... Explain how you qualify less than .800 from pole at sedono and within .200 from the rest of the top qualifiers then finishing Within a second or three from winning or a top 3? Remove 1 mistake and yo win that race. I have not reviewed Catalunya replays yet so i cannot comment on the result yet. I am far from royalty, thanks for the thought though. What I am is someone who is able to look at things through a completely objective point of view and do it by a system that for the most part works well. Life isn't perfect and nor am I. When things are brought up i look and I have even asked others to look. Hell, I have even consulted with ALMS officials to ask how they handle it. I approach this series very professionally and find a racer who claims he is not competitive but is capable of wining a race if he eliminated one of his own mistakes to be very selfish upon himself. I don't take anything anyone here says personal. I manage many employees in my personal life and I have to deal with soooo many personalities I could tell you stories of how two people doing the same task can get such different results and have such different attitudes from the same task is crazy. People are people. My employees all say the same thing, I am fair, (by the book as hell) and they get mad because I am so by the book. But in the end they respect me because they know I treat EVERYONE the same and fair.

That is exactly how I approach this series. I hear your complaints and I address them. Even when I know I should let it go ( you don't here sanctioned bodies explaining to the racers every time a competition adjustment is made or someone whines about things. No you do not. They review and if justified handle it.) I review the tapes ( replays) I mark down mistakes time cost avg lap time, was a racer battling another racer that slowed them both down etc etc...then I make decisions.

I get a little frustrated by the few same people bringing up the same issue and they are up front nearly every race. I expect the people running 19th 25th to do all the complaining. But as I said, I been into racing since I was 8 racing bmx watching any kind of racing on tv and in person....the one thing that stays consistent is racers complaining every race and a race happening every race. I have seen a series SWC have a car come in and dominate by seconds and easily win two races without much effort...they had to make major changes fast because it was an obvious disparity between the Cadillac CTSV and everyone else. They fixed it and the cadilaacs now had to fight every lap and every race. Yep they complained like screaming bullhorns but the series did the right thing and stood their ground and the fans ended up with some great racing. Caddy boys won that season but they had to earn it and only won by 3 points if I remember right.

So I involve myself in the complaints to try and open the eyes of a few. Maybe it would be better if I did like the professional series and say nothing and let the racing on the track show how good the system works. Better look at the qual times, race finishes. Yeah the racing is great and close.

Admin wrote:

...I get a little frustrated by the few same people bringing up the same issue and they are up front nearly every race. I expect the people running 19th 25th to do all the complaining...

and yet the 20th 25th don't lol come on guys♠ why do you deserve an advantage when someone less than you doesn't get it?
its kind of like saying hey he has a nice house but mine just isn't the same i need a bigger house when there are poor people on the streets that aren't as deserving as you? really? THINK before you post something stupid

ATOMS wrote:

...I cant compete with my PI switching every race. I was competitive for a few races and was rewarded with a PI hit, now I cant come within 2 seconds of "A" room...

...Now your being hostile. An organizer of a sanctioned event takes into account all the variables that serve or is counter to its mission...

a small PI hit =/= 2 seconds, find your time like i do by adjust your line.

sometimes hostilities come from being backed into a corner by other hostilities, if that's not true then speak up, i can name quite a few people that have been hostile towards pred and yet they haven't had anything happen because of generosity, not hostility. again Think before you post something that has no back...

SSRT Pronebird wrote:

...Remember Pred doesn't adjust PI based on consistency, but it's become clear that the ability to easily drive fast laps in a car needs to be taken into consideration...

...I really don't think it should be this easy to overcome a 50 point deficit...

...I think the main problem with the Porsche is that it is immune to the PI hit's it receives...

your assuming that he would have won?

and for the immunity to PI, that's a bold claim that has no back to it, tuning and your racing line is where time itself comes from, also consistency helps, which btw, Bimmer is one of the best that i can name at that.

SSRT Pronebird wrote:

...predator again used the "He's just good at this track" excuse which is total bullshit...

...I can tell many of you as well if we had another season on FM3 myself and many others would be in that 997 RS and I don't think anyone wants a league of just one car...

again hostilities, and btw you would lose that Porsche battle 9 times out of 10

SSRT Pronebird wrote:

...Bimmer is not the fastest driver and tuner in this league... He is on level with myself, spurtle, metal. That porsche is stupid easy to run fast laps every lap. No other car compares in that simple category...

...You really must think that every car is as easy to drive as the next then...

... lol that's false, every car bimmer has driven in this series that is equal to that of someone elses, he has run BETTER times than the owner, i would love to say im equivalent to bimmer, but i am .500 second slower every lap in the same car that he is, at ANY track, no more no less, for some reason its really weird but it is.

SSRT Pronebird wrote:

The fact that you honestly believe the driver controls 100% of the consistancy is hilarious. Some cars will react violently to even the smallest mistakes versus other cars. Some cars are so on edge that if you miss your line by a hair your lap is ruined while others can shrug it off. Not to mention that tire temps and pressures will change how a car reacts which affects how the driver has to drive the car. Humans aren't robots.

hello excuse me sorry for being frank but if your car is skittish, TUNE IT BETTER< my car has jumped around quite a bit and i can most of the time control it, but if YOU can't fix what YOU made YOUR car do, then why is it your CAR's fault? if it is not 100% of the driver THEN TURN YOUR AI OFF, and quit complaining...

besides if anyone should get a PI hit its me, i don't practice, yet my car can run some of the quickest times with 1 hour of Sunday pre-races .... just saying, because i don't practice i am inconsistent most of the time and that's why im where i am now.

...
I'm sorry for bursting out here but,

STOP WHINING LIKE A 5 YR OLD CHILD, THIS SEASON IS AS EVEN AS IT HAD EVER BEEN. JUST BECAUSE YOU LOSE A RACE OR MESS UP AND DON'T FINISH 3RD THEN YOU HAVE THE NEED TO HAVE AN ADVANTAGE OVER ANOTHER PERSON IS COMPLETE BULLCRAP IF YOU DON'T WANT HOSTILITIES THEN DON'T SAY STUFF LIKE "how many monkey's does it take to give a porshe a PI hit" IN A PRIVATE LOBBY, IF I HAD ANYTHING TO SAY THAT'S IS LEAVE! IF YOU ARE A POOR SPORT AND CAN'T TAKE THE HEAT THEN STOP BEING A LITTLE &!#$( AND GET THE !@#! OUT. I HAVE HAD ENOUGH OF THIS CRAP

WOW!!!!!

Admin wrote:

WOW!!!!!

i know i have had about enough its sad but i guess everything + a bad day at work just adds up

And just for clarification the person doing the most complaining is the points leader by 21 points as of this writing? Ummm is there something wrong with this picture. I'm just saying.

Metal, go have a Heineken and relax man.


I think Bimmer should have a PI hit, but that's my opinion, and it's just an opinion. It's also an opinion that it's just a case of a very fast driver in a car that's easy to be fast and consistent in, I've seen it many times before and you know what I've learned? I've learned that I just don't care, I know I'm never going to be top 3 every race no matter what car I pick, so I always pick a car that is a challenge and that will make me work to even get a top ten, that's why I picked the Spyker and I know not everyone likes a constant challenge and that's fine too.

That's just the way I have fun. Instead of reading the arguing about PI and joining in, try what I do. Read the post's, laugh at them, and go outside/read a book/kill zombies/do something beside Forza. Don't worry this so much, just have fun.



Disclaimer: I'm on no ones side but my own.

Admin wrote:

As admin I must jump in to hopefully quell some of these fires before they burn out of control. The Porsche 911 GT3 RS is a good car but it is not a dominant car. Why don't we have a spot spec race in it that I set up and we shall see how it turns out, or for that matter we can choose a ford mustang and see how that turns out. BIMM3RR is fast just as in any other sport. There are those people that ARE just damn good and even when the odds are stacked against them they somehow still rise to the top. If the car is so good then everyone here please by all means jump into a 685-690 Porsche and see if you can keep up. BIMM3RR is one of the most consistent racers of this series. He neatly never goes off track or makes anything more than a small error. xXScienceXX you made at least 3 mistakes last race which cost you at least 8- 10 seconds which would have put you with your second win. It's the oldest thing in racing, every racer wants their car to be allowed more power, less weight, less restrictor, the other car has more power, more speed, etc etc. Instead of looking at improving themselves and looking from within to see where can THEY improve THEMSELVES.

Most of the time damn near every time it's not sheer speed that wins races it's the driver who is able to run with e least amount of mistakes AND be quick. At Sedona I watched bimmer hit the sticky sand once early in the race then proceed to pick people off one by one...NOT because he was faster but CLEARLY because one by one people were making mistakes hitting the slow sand, going off track, bumping or battling another racer which slows lap times....everyone upfront kept screwing up and he mad no more errors. This is not All about BIMM3RR and his winning two races and always staying on top. It's about the politics of racing which I full well understand. So the whining, asking for more or saying others need less is as old as racing is. If I put Hamilton or Schumacher in a race prepped car like ALMS car and put any of us in an F1 car and said here 3 races go beat em...I am pretty confident in saying they would still come out with a pretty marginal win. Many times it's not the car it's the driver.

Somehow I am ok understanding that I could place better but I seem to have something catch me off. I get caught up behind a car I am faster than but can only pass right before an area where that car is faster and the battle cost me time and I finish lower, or I make a mistake and go off track a couple of times costing 10-15 seconds positions again. When it all comes together and I run clean and I make the right decisions on track things pay off and I get a good finish. I will not set any car up to make it easier for anyone to win. EVERYONE needs to push just as hard to win as anyone. Right now everyone has the car to win a race but when the racing is this close it's the driver who makes the edge not the car.

After making a long story long the bottom line is, instead of blaming the system which has created some damn good racing maybe look at yourselves. Watch your own replays and see how many times you went off track or made a mistake or maybe even got caught up in someone else's mistake that cost time. When I make adjustments I look at all of these things, When the top 8 of a race finish within 4 seconds of each other after 50laps why the heck should I give the 7th place finisher more anything? it's old hearing over and over, but I guess it's to be expected. I watched the Continental World Challenge race this weekend and the nearly the first words out of the racers was about the weight that was added to the cars or restrictors put on the motor making it hard to do this and that but ummm they were being interviewed because they finished top 3! I had to just laugh out loud because it's the same here. When they interviewed the pole driver who ended up 9th after he got a terrible start from green and fell back and then made a mistake on lap 11 that cost him 3 more positions as he was fighting to climb back to the top 5 he said the same thing that the corvette and the Cadillacs have too much power...yet the finish up front was a battle for the top 5 and it was his fault he fell out of that spot after GETTING Pole.

In a nice way please stop whining folks and start racing cleaner and see how you do. I think I can get Wins more than I have but I don't adjust myself for the same reasons. I understand it ,maybe you should try to.

Umm

Quote :

Rewarding of Equalizing Weight Assigned to Reduce Driver Speed, commonly referred to as “REWARDS Weight,” is a PI equalization system based on the addition and subtraction of PI based on the performance of individual drivers in the previous race(s). The goal of the REWARDS System is to provide close on-track competition between a diverse variety of cars in the top third of the field. REWARDS System PI adjustments are in effect for the next race in which a driver competes in the same class.
For the F3SCS we will adjust P.I. in compensation for the weight penalty. Additionally PI may be increased to increase the potential of slower cars or competitors. The PI is adjusted based upon the performance of each driver or car.

SSRT DWilkerson wrote:

Metal, go have a Heineken and relax man. ...read a book... Don't worry this so much, just have fun.

yeah, im not the person you think i am wilk, lol i don't like beer, im russian i like to get it done quick and efficiently lol XD got to be at least 80proof

books.. put me to sleep theres no fun in that

and not worrying and having fun, lol i am!

-]v[ETA]_- wrote:

SSRT DWilkerson wrote:

Metal, go have a Heineken and relax man. ...read a book... Don't worry this so much, just have fun.

yeah, im not the person you think i am wilk, lol i don't like beer, im russian i like to get it done quick and efficiently lol XD got to be at least 80proof

books.. put me to sleep theres no fun in that

and not worrying and having fun, lol i am!

I got a book for ya.

http://www.amazon.com/Dethklok-Dethalbum-Authentic-Guitar-Tab-Editions/dp/0739057596

Chenstrap wrote:

I got a book for ya.

http://www.amazon.com/Dethklok-Dethalbum-Authentic-Guitar-Tab-Editions/dp/0739057596

why pay when you can get it for free

How about you guys swap cars for a race?

I didn't finish again because of my internet connection. I'm guessing the cause of it is because of the high traffic that is in my home. I will have to do a pre-race for this coming up Sunday due to my work schedual. However, I did have fun for those 8 laps that I participated in!

-]v[ETA]_- wrote:

Admin wrote:

...I get a little frustrated by the few same people bringing up the same issue and they are up front nearly every race. I expect the people running 19th 25th to do all the complaining...

and yet the 20th 25th don't lol come on guys

Sorry for double-post. I just have to say that I can't even finish my races half of the time but I don't complain (except to my ISP).

Metal....All I can Say is WOW man....

Honestly guys I really don't understand why this is such an issue.

Did U guys not have a choice in your car selection? I think this will make for some good racing for next Sunday. A lot of guys will have a chip on their shoulder and more focused.

See ya guys on Sunday.

Hey Pred since we are on the topic of PI Ajustment how about giving me a PI adjustment..Say +20 LOL LOL!!!!

Basicblaq wrote:

Hey Pred since we are on the topic of PI Ajustment how about giving me a PI adjustment..Say +20 LOL LOL!!!!

I'll take +30, thanks.

Just for the record I did see a few incidents that were questionable. Most notable was an early lap 7 incident where xXScienceXx was braking for turn 1 and had his outside tires on the rumble strip. It looks like the car got a bit loose under braking and xXScienceXx tried to correct it and in the process went into the path of Basicblaq who was on the inside braking to get inside. This contact may have been caused by an intentional move to try to block the late braking manauever Basicblaq was attemting or as I stated cause by the outside tires being on the rumble strip when xXScienceXx got on the brakes. That is one incident.

Another to mention is Basticular tapping the left rear of Kemlo's Ferrari spinning him out with the right front of his Audi.

Another would be in A room with PLF Spurtle or Pr0nebird...it's late and I am too tired to look again. I will edit this post when I go back and look again.


EDIT: I have also noticed a couple of racers who's HP has changed without PI adjustment. I am going to go back and watch the replays and review race to race and compare it against the PI adjustment chart I have (tells me what race I gave or removed who PI) and if I discover HP variances that will show there are rule infractions that will then lead to penalties in the form of point reductions. I will then direct said drivers to build to the PI and HP where I determine the build changed. This is a gross infraction that I do take very seriously. The penalty shall come if I determine build change and there will be no misunderstanding!

When will standing be updated?

Yes I got into the left rear of Matt. I think we both agreed it was a racing incident.