SEASON 9 RACE 7 SUNSET PENINSULA

Basicblaq wrote:

killerz2801 wrote:

PI is based on car and driver. And the comment on everyone building an Aston, really???? So we should call it the Aston series? Race boy's situation is different. Does the same car as race boy finish in the top 5 every race??? No.

Not sure if I under stand what you are saying but I haven't seen Raceboy finish below top 3. Ony time he has finished below top 3 is when he lagged out and yes he has raced in different cars. But again I might be reading the comment wrong and for that I am sorry..

I see what you're saying killer. I will never race an Aston in this series, or a lotus for that matter. Its one thing to win in a car everyone knows can do it, that's nothing, no offense matt, you have proven yourself in cars that I cannot drive so seriously no offense. But to win in a car everyone says you can't, Cadillac, that is entirely different and that's why I will not give up. When it finally comes all I will say is I told you so. Even pred offered us a chance to get out of a "terrible" car and we said no. So we have to much pride, who cares. We are nein shiza and we will prove through the worst car that we are the best! I am saying right here right now that even if everyone else abandons this car that I am running it until I win. Once I do that I will keep running because I know it can. This Cadillac is a tough monster to tame but it will happen. I don't care if I have to overcome an Aston or lotus or whatever the future brings, this Cadillac will reign supreme and I will be the one to do it.

Basicblaq wrote:

ROSCOEpCOTRAIN wrote:

killerz2801 wrote:

Ok lead the way. Let me know

In this series its about ease of driving the ONLY CAR easier to drive then the vantage is the lotus

Then U might not like a few of us next season when we pull out the lotus LOL!!!

BRING IT

Im busy at work on a 17 hour job so i cant reply to all the arguments i want to but how does the aston out accelerate the caddy, (when i refer to "the aston" im only talking about rpm so if your refering to skinleys rocketship im sorry) at sunset all that caddy did was pull on me and everyone else. Im at stock power and i think matt is also and maybe even hired so i dont think thafs true. As for the talk of next season, ill be in GT racing my beloved Gallardo 560-2

Dr PiiHB wrote:

I have both built also I'm not sure about ya'lls pi you have built to. I built them to 649 corvette and 639Aston for next season testing. The Aston is better in every way, weight power, all of it at a -10 pi. The corvette is technically lighter but the astons power to weight is better. The handling is also better on track not on paper. There is one car I've found to beat the Aston. Next season nein shiza will field it only astons sign up again.

well one way or another I doubt I will be running an Aston Martin next season because I want to try my hand at GT driving (I know I am not good enough for GT just want to see what those class of cars and racing is like) and doubt I will be running an Aston Martin in GT (most likely a Maserati MC12 or a Lamborghini of some kind).

If I was to run GS straight after this season I would run another Aston Martin (in case your wondering I doubt it would be a V12 Vantage or the DBS), cant say for all the other people who run Aston Martin's, but the reason I have been racing Aston Martin's in FSCS is because Aston Martin is my favourite car manufacturer and I really do like their cars (same reason as why Pred drives the Ferrari 458 Italia in GT every season from what I know).

and to be honest I do not care where I finish in races or what people think of me driving Aston Martins, because I actually enjoy driving the car I have.

**EDIT**

and Sainted from what I know is the same as me he drives Porsches because he is fans of them.

Would it make you happier if I ran a car that no one has ever registered in that is faster than my DBS with less pi?

I won't apologize for picking a car that PI for PI is better than the Vantage, that's what pre-season testing is for.

The banter is great guys. I like the passion in each argument and desire everyone has for a 'fair' field.
I like the fiyah.

Now, my 2cents. This all boils down to just a few simple factors. Each and every person has made a choice on what car they wanted to drive. Many chose simply because that is their favorite car or manufacturer. Each driver has very different skill levels and each car has different pros, and cons, strenghts and weaknesses. Each track is different. So you think about the vast variables that must be dealt with not only for me but for each racer in this series. I do not know how many of you meticulously go through EACH AND EVERY replay but I do. What I see defines the winner at nearly every race. These drivers hit their marks, apexes consistently nearly every lap. Even in traffic the line alters a bit but the apex is still hit and power is put down smoothly with minimal loss of traction. Then I see MANY OF YOU AND I DO MEAN THAT (myself included) That are capable of the exact same pace and hit the same low lap times here and there. But the rest of the laps are half a second maybe a full second or even laps 3 seconds off pace because of making a mistake and going off track, braking too late or many getting damage during the race which slows down each and every lap from the moment occurs. This adds up to distance and space and TIME that adds up over 50 laps. I agree the Aston Martin's are good cars. They are in the real racing world when ever I see them actually racing. But There are many cars that I have driven that are equal to the aston and a couple that I have found are better.

The thing I am saying...voicing your thoughts is nice..but publicly condemning or pointing out people in the forum should not be an option. This forum is read by not only those of us who race but many who are thinking about joining and some by people who are 'fans' of the series. I get PM's by people every once in a while who are members of this forum but are not racers. They just follow us. The pointing of fingers has to stop. Get in YOUR car. Focus on it. You cannot control what goes on in another team or car. But you can maximize what you and your car can do. I will use myself as a CLEAR EXAMPLE. This season has been absolutely horrible for me. I couldn't figure it out. I could not hold a pace, finish a race without damage etc, etc. Then I decided to focus on driving smoother, get back to basics and hit my apexes, not FORCE the car or myself to be faster but to drive the way I know I need to. My result a Podium in both classes.

All this needs to quietly go away. Many of you CARS AND DRIVERS are capable of the exact times some even faster than the ones who seem to win the most races. They are not winning by pure 'better car' they are winning because they are CONSISTENT. Try it. Drive a race for 50 laps, make no or very minimal mistakes get no damage, don't drift corners and lose time because your sideways exiting a corner, dont miss your braking point 10- 15 times a race and lose a second each time. Then see where you end up. Yes a good car can make it a bit easier, but a good driver can make it better. Sometimes pointing fingers is not the answer sometimes look at the mirror to solve the problem. The Cars paired with drivers are very fairly balanced (nothing is perfect) but NO SERIES can make a racer more consistent efficient as a raceer. That's something you must do.

Raceboy, BIMM3RR, And learning that Matthnt may also need to be included are all drivers who hit their marks lap after lap after lap. They run the same pace time and time again with minimal or NO mistakes. While many and I mean MANY run the same lap time maybe 10 laps but the rest are second or more off. That aint the car. That's the driver not getting the most out of the car. The PI helps but sometimes you gotta help yourself.

I won't name names. I know of races in each class where another racer besides the 'normal' winners could have won and others been in the thick of it for top 3. Each race I see the same damn thing. Mistakes, off track, wall contact, or sometimes I see things I can't explain. A racer who looks great one race then next week they couldn't hit an apex if it was glued to their tires.

Long winded but it is tiring to hear all the fingers pointed at the "car" Aston Martin. Many of you should ask for tuning help or spend some time reading the tuning guide provided on this forum, watch some of those videos on Safe is Fast website a link that is provided in this forum. This will help YOU get faster. Speed in racing not only comes from hitting one good fast lap, it comes from hitting that lap nearly every lap. Which 80% do not. Where do YOU fit?

Stepping down and going back to my Admin office.

Edit in..Tune example,,Why do I see tires that after 7 laps are at 23lbs of pressure? Really?! I see cars that have so much camber it's a miracle the car has any stability under braking and doesn't just take a football field extra to brake. Car set up makes a difference.

Going back behind the door again.
Admin

Ok

Stepping back out for one last press conference:

PI- I have been at it for 9 seasons here and ran other leagues from the days of Gran Turismo 3(I had a few of those guys find me here) But to the point. I am sure many of you think ohhh I need more PI my car is too slow, this car is too fast. Truth of the matter is the car is capable, the driver is capable, but the driver does not extract the potential. I am not trying to be a know it all (I know I can come off that way) but when you have experience aren't you supposed to know more than most? So, I have seen it here every season...People join, they race, they complain about 'the system' then they quit. Some leave go to other series...then they come back. This may or may not be the best system out there. But it is the system of THIS series. It works damn good. But even with the best system to balance the field it falls into the drivers hand to get the result.

I have so much data saved it's reeeeediculous. I say that to say this...I have seen a car that someone says is garbage win races, be dominant then 3 seasons later it's crap..Umm I wonder is it the car just somehow changed? There are cars that by design are better platforms for racing where as others need a little more 'help' to get them moving in the right direction.

This is the same in the real world of rubber and carbon fibre. Hell I see it every race with one of my favorite teams....Three drivers in the same car each gets a stint in the car at the Rolex 24 Scott Sharp runs 1:48.2's+/- Justin Van Overbeek runs 1:48.2+/- then Ed Brown runs 1:50.7's +/- in the same EXACT car within the same race and minutes after another driver. Did the car just all of a sudden slow down when he got in? That pisses me off because every time he drives the car goes from running may top three to 8th or 9th or worse every time his stint is over. That's the same thing I see here. Drivers who have the car underneath them but are not getting the most out of the car. This is where the PI system comes in. But I will not give PI just to help a racer make up for his own mistakes or inconsistencies. Once I see the pace is there...You will notice PI comes less and less and maybe not at all. If a racer has a poor result then wonders, 'well why didn't i get more PI, or for the more bold, asks me directly and the PI doesn't come. It's because of my experience, and I see sometimes what a driver fails to see within himself. The car has shown the speed, ability, and potential, the driver has shown the speed, ability and potential and has shown to be able to hit the 'leader area' times Then if that driver only can do it for 10 laps out of 50...that isn't car or PI. I understand that. Some never seem to wrap their minds around it. PI will not be a crutch.

Now many race not to be super competitive but to simply have fun with a bunch of us like minded lovers of Sports Cars and racing. To them who never complain and seem to never get top 10...I salute you. You could be faster but are having fun no matter where you finish. To the racers who win races, show to be fast, can win more races and or has won many races and complains that it aint fair etc...My opinions are low and need not be spoken.

There are so many who complain but is not the system is failing them. They are failing the system. Crashing out, going into the dirt all the time, etc...As Admin sometimes I just want to be so blunt and point out people. But I can't. I have to keep it objective, be the same to everyone who races in this series. Some like me for it or at least respect it. Others don't like me and loath me for it. I get that. It goes with the territory. Many of you will learn this when you become supervisors, business owners, managers etc. Friends that you had for years will start to not like you and may just plain start hating you simply because you now tell them what to do, must write them up if they don't do something right on the job, fire them because they simply needed to be fired. It's the same here in this microcosm of the world in this series.

Thanks for letting me vent a little too.

Admin

Basic: I'm going to send you a car when I get home, accept my request and don't be afraid to put your tune on my car because I know my tune for this car is no where near perfect and its quite a handful

I see where you're coming from pred. I know I have areas to improve on. I spend way more time than I should on this game and trying to get better. I am one of those you speak of. I hit race winning times but only toward the end of a race. I am garbage until I am put under pressure. I could be much better. Saying you don't give pi to help someone get better is understandable. Its to keep everything fair. The only argument I have with that is a certain previously mentioned driver who has shown problems with consistency. Based off of skill alone he would not be running a lobby each race. He would be much farther back. This is the only problem I have with the pi system. Sometimes a driver comes along that is only good because of the system. Like I said I have my faults and could get better. Only running less than half a second behind raceboy in the same car! I never thought I would do that. But I know the car can run faster. He has proved that to me. I think that's the only reason I will not leave this car. I have seen it done now I want to do it.

killerz2801 wrote:

Sand bag anyone? Anyone.........

Never

Matthnt wrote:

Basic: I'm going to send you a car when I get home, accept my request and don't be afraid to put your tune on my car because I know my tune for this car is no where near perfect and its quite a handful

LOL..so does this mean I get to race with u guys next season LOL

Dr PiiHB wrote:

Basicblaq wrote:

killerz2801 wrote:

PI is based on car and driver. And the comment on everyone building an Aston, really???? So we should call it the Aston series? Race boy's situation is different. Does the same car as race boy finish in the top 5 every race??? No.

Not sure if I under stand what you are saying but I haven't seen Raceboy finish below top 3. Ony time he has finished below top 3 is when he lagged out and yes he has raced in different cars. But again I might be reading the comment wrong and for that I am sorry..

I see what you're saying killer. I will never race an Aston in this series, or a lotus for that matter. Its one thing to win in a car everyone knows can do it, that's nothing, no offense matt, you have proven yourself in cars that I cannot drive so seriously no offense.

When you're talking about the lotus you are talking about the Exige correct? If you are like me than you race in cockpit and you already know that you cannot race the Esprit in this series because the roll cage completely blocks your field of vision.

@Killerz: Seeing as how there aren't 5 F50's it can't finish top 5 every race. Also just to be OCD I'll point out that the DBS and the Vantage are two different cars completely made by the same company. It's like if this was last season and Gambit's C4 GS was the winner and the next 4 finishers were C5's or C6's then we could all complain about the Corvettes, not one of the different cars the whole brand in itself. Doesn't make sense to me.

I'm not commenting on this anymore. Y'all make me laugh so hard when I read all this stuff I'll just keep reading

Basicblaq wrote:

Matthnt wrote:

Basic: I'm going to send you a car when I get home, accept my request and don't be afraid to put your tune on my car because I know my tune for this car is no where near perfect and its quite a handful

LOL..so does this mean I get to race with u guys next season LOL

Dunno if I'm racing next season but it sure won't hurt you any to have my build

Thought pointing fingers was over?

killerz2801 wrote:

Thought pointing fingers was over?

Ok killer Matt take no offence....killer at this point there are two fingers you could point...the index indicating your first win or you can do what i do...and use the middle to the world and use that as the fire in your tank
I like the the second

ROSCOEpCOTRAIN wrote:

killerz2801 wrote:

Thought pointing fingers was over?

Ok killer Matt take no offence....killer at this point there are two fingers you could point...the index indicating your first win or you can do what i do...and use the middle to the world and use that as the fire in your tank
I like the the second

None taken Roscoe.

Lol. "No comment".

Yes matt, I'm definitely talking about the exige. That esprit is an amazing car but its tough at some tracks. Its like the Ford gt but worse. Instead of lining up with the roofline like most cars turn 10was like "I got an idea you guys! Lets make the roll cage sit at eye level and completely block the drivers view! Yes that's it. We'll make no one want to drive this car". I wonder if lotus paid extra to have an aggravating car in the game.

Matthnt wrote:

ROSCOEpCOTRAIN wrote:

killerz2801 wrote:

Thought pointing fingers was over?

Ok killer Matt take no offence....killer at this point there are two fingers you could point...the index indicating your first win or you can do what i do...and use the middle to the world and use that as the fire in your tank
I like the the second

None taken Roscoe.

I agree with roscoe. Middle finger to the world and I do what I want. Nein Shiza B¡tches!

I probably shouldn't do this, but here goes; I think the P.I. system works mostly very well. I say mostly, as long as the cars are of a certain catagorical type. If your cars are not radically different between speed and handling and are mostly one or the other, the P.I. system is quite perfect. Where I suspect the P.I. doesn't work all that well is when you have a handling car vs a group of speed cars.

Before anyone jumps on me, let me explain. In order for a handling car to run the same lap times as a faster/speedier car in-race, he must do so by maximizing corner entry and exit because he has no speed on the straights. To do this requires a much deeper braking marker than can be achieved by the less handling speed cars. But get into the race, and the slower handling car has no hope of keeping up in traffic. He needs a clear track to do his deep braking to equal the pace of the speed cars is the point. Especially if it is on a fast track. Knowing this, a smart driver would only pick a handling car if it could out qualify the speed cars, because he knows he will not be that fast in traffic because of a lack of power/speed. So to be fair, a handling car should not be measured as much by its qualifying performance as its in-race performance. Because to be equal in the race, a handling car will likely have to be a little faster in qualifying.

Now, if some P.I. is removed from the handling car, because it has a superior qualifying ability, but only equal race ability, what do you think will happen? The qualifying becomes equalized, but the race performance drops off. Don't believe me? Look at my results in the ST-Class Opal.

I picked the Opal Speedster unaware that it would be downgraded. I picked it because I knew it could do very well on the handling tracks in it's original form, and not so well on the speed tracks. It seemed like a reasonable trade off at the time.

But as it was downgraded, it only became equal or less than equal even on its best tracks. On the fast tracks it has no parity or equality to speak of. It wasn't going to win on the fast tracks even with its original P.I., but now that it has been down graded, even at the places it should have an advantage, it has none. And this is the weakness in the P.I. system, it's a little too generic to account for this type of car imbalance in my opinion. You just can't take a car that wasn't going to win at any of the fast tracks to begin with, and then handicap it on the tracks it should be allowed to be good at. Doing so just means it won't be able to compete let alone win, anywhere. Imagine if the same was done to the speed cars? Imagine making them slower on their preferred fast tracks, (where they should be fast), and then making them really slow on the handling tracks. It just wouldn't be fair.

Not trying to stir trouble or make people mad. I won't be quitting the series either. I just hope that a better more fine tuned P.I. system will be in play come next season to account for this.

I see what you're saying aar. It makes sense. However, I wouldn't count on the pi system being adjusted. It has worked for 9 seasons now and you just have to pick a fast car in this league. The good handling cars get penalized and its hard to keep up unless you can maximize the cars ability even during a race. The system works, you just need a fast car to beat it. Slow cars unfortunately have trouble with the system. Just do what I do, pick the biggest baddest car you can find force it to stay on the track. Screw driving small cars. Being 6'4 and 280lbs, I tend to drive large cars. They work well with my size.

guys, stop making me look bad. when i ran your cars it wasn't with much effort lol.

it's entertaining how many times my name has come up in this discussion. i pick most of my cars based on the fact that i know i won't get a PI bump and if anything, i'll get hit with PI. one exception: street, that was based on the huge wing .

on that note, there are cars that are better than some but driver consistency glows often. although when you hit your marks you may be as fast as someone, if they do it more often you won't keep up. i'm not in GS this season so I can't say much for what's going on there but in GT and ST i know i'm running a super low PI and still managing to keep up and win races even though there are people who are even up to half a second quicker than i am.

obviously there are cars that stick out and need a lower PI than others and vise versa, but a good driver can make almost any car competitive depending on the track and PI given. no offense at all Don but i've watched you drive that opel and driven it myself, consistency is a huge thing that comes into play your performances. that's the same for everyone though, even me. sometimes i have days i just can't hit my mark well.

overall, the cars are different, PI's are different, drivers are different. be consistent and keep out of trouble and you will get your results, it may take time, but they will come. we all know the system isn't perfect, but we're all here to race. if factors aren't going your way, fight it by racing better.

ps. i'm not trying to call anyone out at all, i enjoy all of your competition and racing with you guys <3. oh and don, i expect you to be on my bum or in front of me for maple .

[ahem] Um...so...how 'bout them 'Vettes? Oh btw I got it to hit 191 at LM. Scared anyone?

The LSA wrote:

[ahem] Um...so...how 'bout them 'Vettes? Oh btw I got it to hit 191 at LM. Scared anyone?

LOL..get it up to 205 and then I might be scared LOL!!!